It’s amazing to think that it was just 2002 when Against Me!, the cow-punk band from Gainesville, Florida, released its debut album, Against Me! Is Reinventing Axl Rose. Four albums proceeded in a rapid-fire progression, each one a stepping stone of sorts. While the early work was all angst, more recent recordings found the band developing their sound. With a December 2005 transition from Fat Wreck Chords to major label Sire, Against Me! found themselves called “sell-outs.” Throw in the departure of drummer Warren Oakes in June 2009, and the band had clearly taken its share of damage.
But after three years since 2007’s New Wave, Against Me! returns with White Crosses. Scheduled for a June 8th release, the album stands as potentially the band’s most mature to date. And, despite leaking a full three months early, lead singer Tom Gabel was more than happy to talk not only about the album, but also new drummer George Rebelo (formerly of Hot Water Music), his days as a teenage anarchist, the development of the band’s sound, and more.
How’s the transition from having George Rebelo come in for a full-time gig? Has it changed the dynamic or given you guys a shot in the arm?
All in all, I don’t think the transition could have gone any smoother, which is owed a lot to George in particular. He really jumped head first into the mix of things. He was really only playing with us for a little over a month before we headed out to California to start pre-production. It’s definitely changed the dynamic, which has in turn given us a shot in the arm for sure. It’s been a welcome change too. Really, it’s just forced us to re-examine everything, both our personal relationships with each other and our musical relationships with each other, or how we play together as a band. It doesn’t hurt that George is an incredibly badass drummer.
Where do you see this album in the band’s overall musical arc? It’s a lot more accessible than some of the early stuff, but do you think it’s that much of a deviation from where you guys have been plotting?
I guess I don’t really think in terms like that, as music being “accessible.” When I think of music, the only question I ask: Is it enjoyable? Whether that’s music I’m playing or music I’m consuming. Do I enjoy listening to this? Do I relate to it? Is it intelligent? Or if it’s music that I’m writing, I ask, “Do I enjoy playing this?” The question of “Can anyone else relate?” is part of the whole reason for releasing music publicly. You’re hoping to make a connection, so you don’t feel so alone in the world. Dramatic, right?
There’s a great line in “I Was A Teenage Anarchist” that goes “I was a teenage anarchist, but the politics were too convenient.” Is there a feeling that, as opposed to what others say, you felt stifled by a very rigid, often stifling social movement? Do you guys still consider yourselves to be those same kids, at least in spirit? Or is this album the start of something else?
Oh, completely stifled. Often times still do. There’s almost zero tolerance for individualism in the punk scene, or at least there’s almost zero tolerance for individualism in the punk scene by the self-proclaimed punk scene gate keepers. Cause, what is punk? Is it a style of music? Or is it a mentality? I’d say that judging by the vast stylistic difference between bands that have fallen under the genre of punk, from The Sex Pistols to Fugazi to Atom and His Package, that it’s not a style, it’s an attitude, it’s a mentality. You know what’s punk? Thinking for yourself. Or at least that’s why I got into it. Sometimes I think the punk scene is just as stifling as Christianity, if not more so.
Take, for instance, a couple nights ago, we were playing in San Antonio and, after the show, this woman came up to me and asked the question, in regards to the song we are talking about, “Why did you denounce Anarchism?” Never mind the fact that in no way does the song denounce anarchism, let’s just say it did. What would be the difference between her approaching me asking that question and say asking “Why did you denounce God?” were the song called “I Was A Teenage Christian”? She was coming up, looking for accountability. She was of the opinion that I had denounced my former politics, and that it was some kind of moral abomination. What’s the difference between that and her thinking I’m a sinner for denouncing Christ? It’s the same form of judgment placed on someone you don’t know. And the bottom line is that there’s just no logic that goes into any of it. The scene doesn’t encourage logical thinking, it encourages uniformity.
What was the recording process like? Were there any albums/songs/bands in particular that you guys were listening to during the whole thing?
I spent a couple of weeks in Los Angeles, before the rest of the band came out, working on songs with Butch [Vig, producer of White Crosses]. All in all pre-production lasted for about a month and a half. Tracking took about three months. We recorded at this studio called El Dorado in Burbank, which is a great studio, very comfortable. There was a basketball court right next door to the studio, so any time we got a little stir crazy we’d go shoot a couple hoops. We also had a couple BBQs. I wouldn’t say there were any particular records that I was totally devoted to listening to while writing or recording, but I definitely did listen to a lot of things. On the drive out to Los Angeles I listened to the Handsome Furs and Matt and Kim in almost constant rotation. I also spent a lot of time listening to old Bowie records.
Is there a song or two that you guys are particularly proud of on the album? Something that really exemplifies the kind of overall mission statement of the album?
The answer to this question probably changes for me every day. It’s hard to pick just one song. Let’s just say I stand by the album as a whole.
You’ve released two albums with Sire. What’s your impression of working with a bigger label thus far? Do you miss a smaller operation like Fat Wreck Chords?
Well, we still work with Fat. This past year we released The Original Cowboy and we’re working on another collection of demos/ unreleased songs from the Searching For A Former Clarity era, which should come out, hopefully, some time this year. The bottom line is that record labels are record labels. They all do the same things, just some do certain things better than others. There’s cool people who work at every label and there’s jerks. You just have to figure out who’s who.
There was an interview where you talked about the recording process, and where you did a month of pre-recording stuff with Butch Vig. The band’s songs have always had a feeling of spontaneity, so is that level of craftsmanship new? Have you always labored over things so extensively?
We’ve always labored over things extensively. We’re the type of band that will practice six nights a week for six months straight before going into the studio. I mean, just because we recorded our first full length album in a day doesn’t mean I didn’t spend the previous two years writing and refining the songs. Take one of our earlier songs like “Walking Is Still Honest” for example. That song had already appeared on two separate EPs in vastly different styles before we recorded it for our first full length album. There’s nothing spontaneous about that.
There are a lot of melodies and harmonies in the new album, which you guys have always had. But it seems more in the fore with this record. Do you have any idea how your sound may continue to expand? Are you going to continue to push for a more complicated sound?
We’ll see what happens. There’s never really been a plan or a road map. I’ve always just tried to follow my gut instinct.
