“What if this is a movie where the characters have actually seen a horror movie?” –John Sayles
By the dawn of the 1980s, there hadn’t been a genuinely successful werewolf film in years. And in the wake of films like The Last House on the Left and Halloween, which brought horror to the cities and suburbs where most Americans lived, torch-wielding villagers and mythical monsters lurking around the European countryside seemed quaint. Even when the cinematic werewolf mythology was occasionally modernized in the 1970s, with films like Werewolves on Wheels and The Werewolf of Washington, the results were lackluster.
But just as the sub-genre appeared to lose its bite, The Howling burst onto screens and changed everything. The first in a series of three werewolf-centric films released in 1981 — Wolfen and An American Werewolf in London opened later that summer — The Howling helped to revitalize the waning subgenre by mixing wry satire with genuine scares (artfully conceived by director Joe Dante and screenwriter John Sayles) and state-of-the-art makeup effects by the legendary Rob Bottin. This decidedly modern take on classic horror tropes created a singular vision that can still be felt within pop culture 40 years later: from the expansive series of sequels and werewolf films it spawned, to other self-aware horror films like Scream (“What’s that werewolf movie with E.T.’s mom in it?”), they all owe a debt to The Howling.
To celebrate its 40th anniversary, several of the people involved in the making of film were interviewed about their roles in creating this influential horror classic. Specifically, director Joe Dante, producer Mike Finnell, screenwriter John Sayles, actor Dee Wallace, actor Robert Picardo, editor Mark Goldblatt, and studio executive Robert Rehme.
Based on pulpy bestseller by Gary Brandner, The Howling’s journey to the screen began when producer Steven A. Lane and director Jack Conrad purchased the film rights to the book, and brought the property to fledgling mini-major AVCO Embassy. However, the duo would not stay on the project long. When concerns arose about the film’s direction under Lane and Conrad, AVCO Embassy turned to a group of hungry young filmmakers looking to break out of Roger Corman’s New World Pictures: director Joe Dante, producer Michael Finnell, and screenwriter John Sayles.
Tossing out the original script, and most of the book, this new creative team quickly instituted dramatic changes. With an eye towards the modern, they infused the screenplay with biting social commentary that lampoons self-help groups, the ubiquitous smiley face logo, and the clichés of horror films themselves. But while writing the script, they made the crucial choice to include an elaborate transformation sequence that relied heavily on new technology and the skills of a makeup effects wiz just out of his teens, Rob Bottin.
MICHAEL FINNELL, PRODUCER: I worked for Roger Corman and worked my way up through the ranks [at New World Pictures]. Ultimately, I was producing for him. I produced some additional scenes for a movie called I Never Promised You a Rose Garden, which was one of Roger’s attempts to get a little classier than most of his normal fare. The producer of the movie was Edgar Scherick, a really old school producer, and he had a younger partner named Dan Blatt.
Afterwards, I guess [Blatt] liked the way I handled things because he called me and said, “I have this movie called The Howling but I’m not really available. I have a bunch of other things going on and I can’t really produce it myself. I’ll be the executive producer, but would you like to produce it?” So I said, “Yeah!” I had only worked for Roger — Rock n Roll High School was my last venture there — and I figured I had to move on at that point because I had gone as far as I could go. [Dan Blatt] sent me the script, which was based on a book by Gary Brandner. I wasn’t crazy about the script, but on the other hand, it was a movie to produce outside of Roger.
The origin of [The Howling] is that a guy named Steve Lane had partnered with another guy named Jack Conrad, who directed a really low-budget movie. Steve Lane bought the rights to the book and Jack Conrad wrote the script based on the book and was going to direct the movie. It was for a company called AVCO Embassy, which was originally formed by Joseph E. Levine, who had started by [distributing] Hercules movies starring Steve Reeves. Anyways, he formed this company called Embassy, but by this time, he was no longer involved in the company. The company was [now] run by Robert Rehme. He had been the head of Roger’s distribution, so I kind of knew him, too.
ROBERT REHME, STUDIO HEAD (AVCO EMBASSY): AVCO Embassy was owned by Avco Corporation, a large public company based in Connecticut, and it had bought Embassy from [Joseph E. Levine]. He left after that and then I came in. I enjoyed being there and Avco was quite interesting. Avco stood for Aviation Corporation. They made airplanes, they had all kinds of interesting businesses. Some big public companies had bought movie businesses at that time. But we were not going for anything too expensive. We couldn’t afford that, we had no money. It was my decision to focus on young directors that I thought could make exciting films. I got Joe Dante, John Carpenter, and a number of people to do films that were easily promotable.
JOE DANTE, DIRECTOR: Since Rehme had come from New World Pictures, he was very well versed in selling that kind of picture and even how to make it. So the complexion of the movies that AVCO Embassy was making changed when he showed up and they became a genre [film] supplier — they had Cronenberg and Carpenter — so it was a place to go to make those kind of pictures. They were low-budget but they weren’t really cheesy. They were very cost conscious but the movies didn’t look crappy. They were pretty well photographed and they were pretty well produced under the circumstances. They competed very well with the studio pictures and they were all pretty successful. But the AVCO Embassy pictures were a slight step up because they were a little bit classier, or viewed as such.
FINNELL: So we started to work with [Conrad] on pre-production. And as things progressed, Dan and I started to get worried that this guy wasn’t really going be able to pull this off. First of all, he wanted to use real wolves, which would have been insane. The movie was going to happen, Bob Rehme wanted to make it. It wasn’t like a development deal, it was a greenlight movie. But we were worried that if we proceeded with this guy it would not work out well.
DANTE: Mike Finnell, who was my producer on many movies, had been hired as line producer on this picture. It became apparent to him that they were having some problems. The studio was having some problems with the director and the direction of the movie. And so they started to put out feelers: “Maybe we could bring somebody else in here.”
FINNELL: I knew Joe from working with Roger Corman and we become friends. I worked as the assistant prop man on Hollywood Boulevard, Joe’s first movie that he co-directed with Alan Arkush. I said, “I’m sure that Joe would love to make a werewolf movie because he’s a horror movie guy.”
DANTE: I was at Universal making what would have been my first studio picture — Jaws 3, People 0 — but there was a tremendous amount of turmoil on that picture and it looked to me like it wasn’t going to happen. And then I got a call from Mike saying, “Do you think you might want to do a werewolf picture?” I said, “Naturally. I mean, who wouldn’t want to do a werewolf picture?” But in the meantime, I couldn’t just walk out on this other movie because it was a studio picture. It was supposed to be my big break. But as luck would have it, that movie just fell apart in time for me to take the job on The Howling.
FINNELL: [Joe] read the script and said, “I would love to make a werewolf movie but not this werewolf movie, not this script.” I said, “I can’t argue with you about that.”
DANTE: What they had was [a script] based on this paperback bestseller by Gary Brandner. It was one of those books that reads fine when you’re on the bus but then if you really want to think about it, doesn’t really make a lot of sense. So if you’re trying to do a movie, you can’t really be too faithful. And they were being fairly faithful to the book. I read the script and it was really ludicrous. It was just a really bad adaptation and the dialogue was unspeakable.
So I said to Bob Rehme, “I think we can do better than this. Why don’t you let me bring on a new writer and we’ll work on it. We’ll try to find a way to adapt the book into something that’s watchable.” So Terry Winkless came on board. He and I shut ourselves off for however long it was and tried to do a version of the script that still adhered to the book but made sense. Even when we had finished that, it really just didn’t click.
FINNELL: Terry was a really good writer and I think what happened was we still stayed a little too close to the book. What he did was a huge improvement over the original script, but it still wasn’t quite there. The feeling was we needed a completely fresh approach. Terry was probably, unfairly by us, saddled with too much from the original book.
DANTE: So I said, “Well, John Sayles just rewrote my last picture, Piranha, and maybe he’d want to do it.”
FINNELL: John basically threw out the book.
JOHN SAYLES, SCREENWRITER: When I looked at the book, my main problem with it was just how obvious it was, right away, who the real werewolves were. It was the usual: the woman hears howling at night and she comes into town the next day and everybody she talks to says, “We didn’t hear any howling?” And of course you know they must be werewolves. We heard that, everyone with ears heard that.
DANTE: I think the problem with the book is that all the characters are cardboard. It’s not a character book. It’s a fantasy thriller book that you’re just supposed read and turn the page, which is fine. There were certain things you couldn’t get away from. You had to have a heroine who has this traumatic experience — I think she’s raped in the book — and then she’s taken to recuperate in this closed village, which is boarded up but on the main highway. And all the people hiding inside the buildings are all werewolves. The mistake we made was sticking too close to the book for too long. When John came in, he basically threw out most everything except the lead character [Karen]. I don’t think there’s a Dr. Wagner character in the book. I mean, that’s half the movie right there.
SAYLES: So we started talking back and forth about a couple things, and I think the most important one was: “What if this is a movie where the characters have actually seen a horror movie?” So they don’t seem so clueless and so there’s just a little bit of, “Oh, come on. This is just like the movies.” But it’s not, because we wanted to do some different things.
FINNELL: The idea was to make sure that people realized, while watching the movie, that werewolves are something that’s known in popular culture. So we had the clip of The Wolf Man in the movie, rather than pretend like, “Oh my god, a man turned into a wolf! Whoever heard of such a thing?” We wanted to make sure that characters in the movie knew that was the thing.
DANTE: Werewolf movies at the time were considered old hat, and the last few that had come out hadn’t really done very well. I didn’t think that promoting this as a werewolf picture was really the way to go. So, we tried to make it look like a slasher picture, which was very popular at the time, and AVCO Embassy traded in slasher pictures. They were very good at selling them. We tried to work it out so that the supernatural elements of the picture didn’t really show-up until the audience was already hooked on the story and the characters and what was going on with them.
Then we dragged in the idea that, “This is the old-fashioned werewolf that you’ve heard of but this is a modern world and we have characters in our movie who know as much about werewolves as you and the audience do.” Which was a big departure. Usually they would take a lot of time on a movie to go to the learned professor, and the professor would tell them a whole bunch of stuff about vampires or werewolves or whatever. Stuff the audience already knew, and everybody would go out for popcorn.
I decided that I probably would never get to make another werewolf movie, so this needs to be my statement on werewolf movies. So, I insisted on having people watch The Wolf Man and to have all of the clichés that we’ve come to know be seen by the characters firsthand on TV, which made it easier to dismiss them.
SAYLES: And then the second big conversation we had was about free will. The myth, the folklore that the original werewolf movies come from, they’re about shape changers. Sometimes it’s a wolf, sometimes it’s a panther, but the main idea is you make a deal with the devil or whatever and you can change your shape, commit a crime, then change it back, and walk away. And they’re looking for paw prints, not your prints. Well, there’s free will involved in that. The Hollywood version of it was that the poor guy got bitten by one of these creatures, and now whenever there’s a full moon he loses his free will, turns into a werewolf, and does terrible things that he feels really bad about. So, when the full moon starts coming close, he wants to be locked up somewhere so he can’t hurt any of his friends.
Well, one of the things I said was, “First of all, if you go with that full moon thing, you can have action and then you have to wait a month. There’s only one full moon a month. What do we do to fill in the rest of the time?” But also, “What if we go back to the idea that there is some free will involved? Yes, maybe on the full moon you have to turn into a werewolf, but the rest of the time it’s optional, and you can get away with incredible stuff. Or you have to figure out, how am I going to deal with the modern world? They’re worried about predation.”
And so once we started into that idea of the werewolves having free will, I brought up the possibility, and then developed it into the script, of these EST and primal scream kind of groups. What if the werewolves, instead of just living in some town, are at some place where they’re literally trying to cope with being werewolves, and partly by repressing it. And that kind of led to the stuff that’s different about The Howling than your average werewolf movie.
FINNELL: At the time, these new age self-help organizations were big, EST was one up in northern California. So he came up with the great idea of an EST-like place that was all werewolves. They were trying to get the werewolves to deal with their inner beast and channel it, which was hilarious.
DANTE: There was a self-help thing going on in the 1980s, being self-aware and learning about yourself, and going to lectures where you had to wear catheters because you weren’t allowed to leave. It was a very strange period, but it was very helpful for us because we were able to couch all of our nonsense, basically, in a whole bunch of psychobabble gobbledygook. We had a character who was a doctor [and] popular TV figure leading the cult, basically. And this was also around the Jim Jones period, which I think is referenced in the movie. So it was very up to date.
SAYLES: All those groups were around and they were very hip for awhile. Some of them turned into dangerous cults, which had already happened with the Weathermen, the Charlie Manson kind of people, and stuff like that. So there was always this edge of, “Well, this could turn ugly.” And I was interested in in dealing with that. This is kind of like a cabal, which we’ve seen in the movies before, but let’s put the two things together.
DANTE: People were weary of old-fashioned werewolf movies because, indeed, they were old-fashioned. We can’t have villagers with torches anymore, this is the modern world. So this managed to take a lot of the weaknesses in the werewolf plot and overcome them by saying, “No, this is just an adjunct. This is a group of people who are trying to fit into society because they’re really antisocial and they are trying to overcome their baser instincts but, of course, they can’t because it’s in their nature.” That seemed to be a pretty compelling attitude.
FINNELL: So he came out and rewrote it. John is incredibly facile and fast. I think he wrote the script in two weeks, literally.
SAYLES: Some of it is that I do write very fast when I know what I’m supposed to do, when I have a good mandate. Also, there was a lot more happening in those days, people weren’t so note happy. Things actually got made a lot quicker.
DANTE: [Sayles] was almost always rewriting [scripts]. He wasn’t coming up with stories. He wasn’t inventing them. He was basically fixing them. [Sayles also] got the assignment for Alligator, which is a made for Group One, an even lower budget version of AVCO Embassy. He lived in New Jersey and so somebody would have to fly him in. Sometimes, the two movies would split the cost of having John come in.
SAYLES: I was in a low-rent motel on the Sunset Strip. Both of those movies were in play and so I was working on both at the same time. I may even have been working on a third script for all I know. They get started, then different companies take longer to read your draft, and so you can’t just write one thing at a time, especially if you’re just making scale in those days. So pretty much whenever I got an offer that I thought was interesting, I’d take it. And what that meant was I might be doing this third draft of one thing while I do the first draft of something else, but they would be made six months or a year apart.
DANTE: If you went to knock on his door to find out how things were going, he would say, “Who is it?” Then you would hear him pulling paper out of the typewriter and putting in a different piece of paper because he was writing them all at the same time. In the end, I was convinced that one of the sequences in my picture was supposed to be in Alligator and vice versa. They were so similar that sometimes I think he would actually get confused to which movie he was writing.
SAYLES: So yeah, I was working on both. And when people would come to talk to me, I’d just say, “So who’s that?” I was still typing on an electric typewriter and I was like, “What should I have in the typewriter? What pages should be in front of me when they come in?”
FINNELL: It’s impossible for [Joe] to do anything without a sense of humor in it. John Sayles is also very funny and has a tremendous gift with sly humor. It really worked out well. The script was terrific.
SAYLES: I would say some [of the humor] was written in and some is just knowing, by that point, Joe’s sensibility and his style. I knew he was going to add a lot of stuff. A lot of the film reference stuff is stuff that Joe put in. He had me name some of the characters after people who had directed werewolf movies. And because you have a lot of characters and you’ve got to give them names, I think a lot of the other characters are named after Pittsburgh Pirates relief pitchers. I was a Pirates fan.
I think [the script’s humor] was probably about 50/50 of stuff I wrote in that was meant to be funny and then just stuff that Joe found, like Roger Corman shows up and check the phone to see if there’s any coins, which was very much an in joke. Putting the [smiley face] sticker on the on the phone booth or at the porn booth, that was Joe’s idea.
DANTE: Well, I think a lot of us always found [the smiley face logo] sinister anyway.
SAYLES: I felt like, knowing [Joe], he’ll make these things more interesting and he’ll pull all these things off. But honestly, I wrote most of Piranha before Joe was assigned to direct it. I did several drafts of The Lady in Red before Lewis Teague was assigned to it. I wrote Battle Beyond the Stars and I never met Jimmy Murakami. So, it was a luxury on The Howling and Alligator to know who the directors were and feel like, “I can write this and they’ll do a great job.”
[It was a collaborative process] because we did know each other already. I did get to sit with [Joe] and Mike Finnell and work some of these ideas out before I went off and did my first draft. They would come back with story ideas and sometimes just with practical things: “This is the problem that’s going to cost us a lot of money” or “we’re looking at this one actor.” At some point [Joe] said, “We’re thinking of getting Slim Pickens for the sheriff. Can you make the sheriff part at least look a little bigger?”
And so I not only padded a few things, but also broke one of the big speeches up into a couple of pieces. And apparently when Slim Pickens came on the set, he said, “Boys, this dialogue fits me like a glove.” Which is what you get to do when you can have some back and forth. You can tailor things a little bit more.
DANTE: There was obviously a parameter with which you had to stay because it wasn’t an expensive film. The difficulty was doing special effects. How much of the budget are the special effects going take up? And how are we going make these things look like it’s not a guy in a bear suit? Which is what a lot of our initial efforts looked like.
Lupine bodies and human bodies just don’t have the same proportions at all, and we didn’t want to do the classic Lon Chaney Jr. version of a guy with a werewolf head and werewolf hands but an otherwise regular body. We loved all of those pictures but we they were passé and we didn’t want to do that anymore.
So, one of the keys to making the picture work and actually getting AVCO Embassy to make the picture was to say that we were going to try to do new things. To do transformations on screen that were much more complicated than the ones they were able to do in the 1940s.
FINNELL: The Wolf Man was old news, although it was good make-up for the time. So we actually found old woodcuts [of werewolves] from the 15th or 16th century, there’s a shot of it in the movie, which looked much more like a wolf. It was a huge wolf but it’s on its hind legs. So we said, “That’s what the werewolves should look like.”
DANTE: We did a lot of testing. Initially, Rick Baker was going to do the picture. Then John Landis, who had been nursing a werewolf picture for a number of years and had gotten Rick to say he would do [his film], found out that Rick was working on our picture, then called him up and lowered the boom: “You can’t do his picture! You’ve got to do my picture! I’ve just gotten the money for it!”
So, Rick had to leave and he put in charge his second in command, Rob Bottin, who had worked with me on Piranha. He was very young. He was like 19 but, in many ways, he was a genius. He was able to come up with a whole raft of things, based initially on Rick’s original tests, that didn’t involve keeping the actor in a chair for six hours to have makeup applied by using fake heads and animatronics in ways that had not really been done before. It was very interesting.
FINNELL: As we wrote the script, we hired Rob and we were able to get AVCO Embassy to start spending money on pre-production. He started designing the werewolf effects and everything. We went ahead and made the movie.
With a finely tuned script now ready, Finnell and Dante began to cast The Howling’s array of colorful characters. They assembled a cast of fresh-faced actors for many of the film’s younger roles during a casting call, while Dante cherry-picked some of his favorite character actors for many of the film’s older parts. And Dee Wallace, an ideal choice for the film’s lead Karen, helped cast her on-screen husband, while Rob Bottin had final say on the casting of Robert Picardo.
FINNELL: Susan Arnold, who was the director Jack Arnold’s (Creature From the Black Lagoon) daughter, was initially the casting director but she had other commitments. And so she had a friend named Judith Weiner do the readings with the actors and everything. It was a combination of Judith and Susan finding actors that we didn’t know, which was mostly for the younger parts, and us being able to populate the rest of the cast with people that we had grown up watching. Searching for Dee Wallace’s role was a very long, drawn-out process. We went through all kinds of names and saw all kinds of people. But when we finally met Dee, we realized we hit the jackpot. She was perfect.
DANTE: I had seen Dee in 10, where she is, I guess, playing a prostitute. She really impressed me in that movie. When it was suggested that she might do a picture like [The Howling], I was very impressed: “Really? You think we could get her?”
DEE WALLACE, ACTOR (KAREN WHITE): I went in and auditioned, then I went in for a callback, and then they hired me. My thoughts were it was a job and it was the lead in a movie. It was going give me the opportunity to do a lot of emotional work, which I love. Really, that’s where I was at. It’s not like, “Oh, I’m a star and this is below me.” I was thrilled that it was the opportunity to do a lead.
DANTE: And she came in and she was excited and very nice, and helped in the casting process. She came in to read with other people and all that kinds of stuff. She was very into it. She was very dedicated. So that was an incredibly lucky break for the movie to have somebody that good in that part.
WALLACE: Dan Blatt, our wonderful, fabulous producer, called me and said, “We’ve got a lot of great people surrounding you in the cast. We just can’t find anybody yet to play your husband.” And at that point I had never gotten involved in casting. I said, “Well, exactly what are you looking for?” And he said, “We need somebody really strong and virile, but with a real vulnerable side.” And I went [to myself], “Oh my God, I’m engaged to him.” But in one second I thought, I can’t say that because they’ll never hire him if they know. So I said, “You know, um, I worked with this guy on CHiPs, Christopher Smith or Stone. Some s-word.” And so they went out and found him, called him in, and he booked it.
DANTE: She suggested [Christopher Stone], but we didn’t know that they were a couple until after we hired him. I think one of the producers called her number to talk to her and he answered.
WALLACE: The next day, Dan Blatt calls. I pick up the phone and he goes, “Dee?” And I go, “Hi, Dan.” He said, “I’m sorry, I must have called the wrong number. You know that guy you recommended? Well, we loved him and we hired him.” I said, “Yeah, you didn’t call the wrong number, Dan.” And then there was this long pause, and he goes, “Oh, shit.” He said, “You’re going to gang-up on me.” And I said, “No. Look at it this way, you only have to get one trailer.”
FINNELL: We didn’t care. He was perfect for the part. Two for the price of one. Not really two for the price of one, but he’ll be able to drive her over to the set. Not that we could afford drivers at all, really, to pick up actors.
DANTE: He’s really good. He’s very sympathetic and very macho and all that kind of stuff. We really lucked out. It’s a good cast. There’s no ringers in the cast.
ROBERT PICARDO, ACTOR (EDDIE QUIST): I was a fairly successful theater actor with two leads on Broadway under my belt by the age of 24. So to do a genre movie like that out of the gate, some of my actor friends thought, “What the heck are you doing?” But even I probably thought that.
I was in David Mamet’s first produced play, Sexual Perversity in Chicago. Shortly after that, I was cast in a play called Gemini. And while I was in that play, I auditioned for the plum role of the following Broadway season for a young actor, which was to play Jack Lemmon’s son in a play called Tribute. The play had maybe six or seven characters but the son was definitely the second lead to Jack Lemmon’s character. That was at 24-years-old that I opened in that play opposite him. I want to say [this was] the beginning of the summer of 1978. And then the following year, in 1979, I recreated the role with Jack in the Los Angeles production and Joe Dante saw me play the role.
At the end of the first act, I had a very explosive emotional scene where I catch [Jack’s character] having sex with his ex-wife, who happens to be my mother, and I love the stepfather. So I am really enraged that this terrible thing has happened and I just yell at him. And in that scene, because you had to go from zero to sixty emotionally in one second, I guess that emotional risibility made Joe think, “Well, there’s my werewolf.” There was something about that explosive anger that made him want to audition me for the role.
So I went in and had a regular audition for Susan Arnold, the casting director. I think I got the part because I successfully creeped out the casting director so much in reading with her. It was the scene in the porn booth where Eddie is behind Dee Wallace’s character and he won’t let her turn around to look at him. He’s just talking in her ear. So I got behind the casting director and just my voice creeped her out enough that they probably cast me just because of the reactions on her face.
DANTE: [Robert Picardo] came into the casting session and read the porn booth scene and she was so creeped out that we knew we had to get this guy. He was just so magnetic with her. Plus, he was such a great ad-libber.
FINNELL: [Picardo] is a Yale trained stage actor. He came in, read, and totally freaked her out. We said, “This is the guy. He’s perfect.”
DANTE: His other great attribute was that he was willing to sit still for hours on end in Rob Bottin’s makeup. To do those casts, the suffocating plaster casts that you have to do in order to make these appliances, he was so cooperative.
PICARDO: It was the strangest casting situation because, even though they wanted me to do it, I had to be approved by Rob Bottin. Joe wanted me to do it but he knew that Rob had to be all in with my casting. That was an agreement he had with Rob. Rob’s work hinged so significantly on the actor who played that character because the transformation scene was going to be the money sequence.
But Rob had to hang out with me and realize that I was willing to really go for it. Every makeup designer’s terror is that the actor is going to get all this shit on him and then he’s going to either freak out or freeze up or just not come through. His performance won’t come through the rubber and the rubber will look dead. You have to really be willing to animate your face and move the rubber to make it look real. He wanted to make sure that I was willing to really go for it.
So we hung out a few days. We had makeup application tests and all that, and he basically decided that he approved of my casting. I remember getting through the makeup test sessions and the design sessions more than shooting the movie itself. [Rob] had an old pickup truck and he would drive me around, and he just kept looking over at me, like he was assessing me. He’d work with actors before because he’d already worked on a few movies, but I was this Broadway theater actor and maybe he thought I was going to think of myself as some young Laurence Olivier. But we had fun hanging out. He was good company, he made me laugh, and he was just different from anybody I’ve ever met.
We stayed friends. I haven’t seen Rob in the last several years, but we maintained a friendship for many years after that.
FINNELL: Then for a lot of the other supporting roles — Joe has an encyclopedic knowledge of old movies, so he always likes to, where possible, populate roles with actors that he loves from old movies. So we had Kenneth Tobey, Slim Pickens, and, of course, John Carradine, who’s incredible.
DANTE: I had tried to get John Carradine in Piranha for the part that ended up being played by Keenan Wynn…but we did hire him for this one. He was at a point in his career where he would do almost anything. He had ex-wives to deal with and he had kids to deal with and all that. So he was working on everything, but didn’t treat this movie with any less reverence than any big movie that he would do. He was a total professional. He was getting to a point where he was a little bit rusty with his lines, but he was a joy.
PICARDO: I think Patrick Macnee is an unsung hero in that film because he’s so likable and he’s such a gentleman that he exudes authority. He’s so well intentioned [in the film].
DANTE: Everybody knew [Patrick Macnee] best from The Avengers [TV show] and he had that persona — he was very tall and very imposing. What I was trying to do with this part, who ends up being a villain, is cast it with somebody that the audience liked. So that they feel, “Oh, look. He’s a nice guy and is trying to help her.”
Christopher Lee was proposed [for Macnee’s role]. I was a big Christopher Lee fan and I would have loved to make the movie with him, except that it would have killed the movie. Because as soon as you saw Christopher Lee you would have said, “Oh, he’s the villain.” So I said, “No, we can’t go there.”
But I did want to use somebody British. So I thought, Well, let’s see if Patrick McNee will do this. So he came in one day and was very charming, which was his stock in trade. He’s good in the movie and he did everything we asked. Except he said, “I don’t want to do werewolf makeup. That’s the only thing I ask.” We managed to find a way to not to have to do that.
WALLACE: Patrick [Macnee] was the nicest, sweetest, most soft-spoken gentleman. He was just beautiful for me to work with. He and Chris got along great. All the classic older actors would sit around the [set] and Chris would go sit with them. They would regale him with all their stories of the olden days when they were coming up. Let me tell you, they had hundreds of stories between all of them.
DANTE: I decided to do the [clapperboard] myself so I could hear the stories [John Carradine] was telling [in-between takes]. Then I would do another take, even if I didn’t need it, just to hear the end of the story. Because when you’re making a low-budget movie, you hire people like Carradine, Slim Pickens, and people like that, who have gobs of fascinating information about Hollywood history and you don’t really have time to shoot the shit with them because you’re so busy. You just take what you can get.